Editing Eurovision Wiki:Biographies of living persons/Noticeboard (section)

== Nala Ray interviews (including Charlie Kirk) specifically ==

Breaking this off from the general section about BLPSPS and video interview above, because [[User:TarnishedPath]] has an objection to the specific use of ''[[The Charlie Kirk Show]]'' in the [[Nala Ray]] article. {{ucfirst:{{they}}}} write: {{tq|The OP started this topic I think because of my review on a [[WP:DYK]] nomination. See the links I provided above. One of the YouTube video's is from Charlie Kirk. Do I trust Charlie Kirk to not have engaged in selective editing? Fuck no.}}

As I wrote in the DYK [[Template:Did you know nominations/Nala Ray]], I don't think ''[[The Charlie Kirk Show]]'' qualifies as a self-published source. {{tq|The Charlie Kirk Show was a whole media empire, not a one man band}}. This was possibly the single most prominent US conservative religious show; Kirk did not personally and solely do his own camera work, editing, publicity, half a dozen other things, he had a whole group of people working with him. Now that in itself doesn't make the show reliable, any more than ''[[Pravda]]'' was reliable; it just makes it not a self-published source. 

In fact, I'm a pretty experienced editor. I've been here for over 20 years, I've written over a hundred articles <small>(which isn't actually that much for 20 years, many can do that much in one year, I'm ''slow'')</small>, and I both know and care about why we need to get people's biographies ''right''. And, well, from that ''Pravda'' reference you can guess where and when I'm from; I know a thing or two about unreliable sources.{{smiley|tongue}} I would not be citing ''The Charlie Kirk Show'' for controversial statements about a living person that that living person did not make herself. But in this case, I know she did, because I can see her making them. Sure, I can accept you don't trust Charlie Kirk not to have engaged in selective editing (obscenity). But in the specific statements I'm citing, they were either:
* anodyne (where she lived, how many siblings she had) or 
* she made those statements on half a dozen video interviews, and I'm specifically choosing to use ''The Charlie Kirk Show'' because it was the most prominent one, and if they were edited, then they would have to have been edited by multiple unrelated interview shows, in exactly the same way, in each case without making it obvious that they were editing parts of hour-long continuous interviews, not separate clips. That's a lot to ask for; enough that I can say it's not reasonable.

That's why I feel confident that these are her statements. If you would like, I can go through every non-anodyne statement cited to ''The Charlie Kirk Show'' and cite it to at least two other unrelated long, not clip, video interviews where she says the same thing. It will make the article clunky, but so it goes. Would that suffice? --[[User:GRuban|GRuban]] ([[User talk:GRuban|talk]]) 14:13, 13 March 2026 (UTC)

:Charlie Kirk should never be anywhere near a Wikipedia reference. <span style="border:1px solid #6E41B5;padding:2px">[[User:Skyshifter|<span style="color:#6E41B5;">Skyshifter</span>]]</span><span style="background:#6E41B5;border:1px solid #6E41B5;padding:2px">[[User talk:Skyshifter|<span style="color:white"><small>talk</small></span>]]</span> 14:17, 13 March 2026 (UTC)
::Even if we were perfectly sure that it was a true statement, we should still not use it, on political principle? --[[User:GRuban|GRuban]] ([[User talk:GRuban|talk]]) 14:21, 13 March 2026 (UTC)
:::On reliability principle, yes. <span style="border:1px solid #6E41B5;padding:2px">[[User:Skyshifter|<span style="color:#6E41B5;">Skyshifter</span>]]</span><span style="background:#6E41B5;border:1px solid #6E41B5;padding:2px">[[User talk:Skyshifter|<span style="color:white"><small>talk</small></span>]]</span> 14:28, 13 March 2026 (UTC)
:::It might be viable for [[WP:ABOUTSELF]] but even then it's probably better to find a source that's actually reliable. [[User:Sesquilinear|Sesquilinear]] ([[User talk:Sesquilinear|talk]]) 16:41, 13 March 2026 (UTC)
:Many Wikipedia editors are too quick to entirely discard sources that they don't like (often for ideological reasons). There's no reason to doubt that a ''TP USA'' interview is reliable for anodyne about-self details. <span style="white-space: nowrap;">—[[User:Compassionate727|Compassionate727]]&nbsp;<sup>([[User talk:Compassionate727|T]]·[[Special:Contributions/Compassionate727|C]])</sup></span> 20:49, 14 March 2026 (UTC)