Editing Eurovision Wiki:Dispute resolution noticeboard (section)

== Graham Platner ==

{{DR case status}}
<!-- [[User:DoNotArchiveUntil]] 17:50, 15 April 2026 (UTC) -->{{User:ClueBot III/DoNotArchiveUntil|1776275446}}<!-- REMEMBER TO REMOVE THE PREVIOUS COMMENT WHEN CLOSING THIS THREAD! -->
{{drn filing editor|EasternShah|17:50, 18 March 2026 (UTC)}}

<span style="font-size:110%">'''Have you discussed this on a talk page?'''</span>

Yes, I have discussed this issue on a talk page already.

<span style="font-size:110%">'''Location of dispute'''</span>
* {{pagelinks|Graham Platner}}
<span style="font-size:110%">'''Users involved'''</span>
* {{User|EasternShah}}
* {{User|GorillaWarfare}}
* {{User|Generalrelative}}
<span style="font-size:110%">'''Dispute overview'''</span>

EasternShah added [https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Graham_Platner&diff=prev&oldid=1344025964 verifiable information] about Platner's service in Iraq using a source that was already in the article. EasternShah was reverted and told to find consensus. Their attempts to find consensus have been fruitless, so they think a wider participation would be helpful.

<span style="font-size:110%">'''How have you tried to resolve this dispute before coming here?'''</span>

[[Talk:Graham Platner#Abu Ghraib]]

<span style="font-size:110%">'''How do you think we can help resolve the dispute?'''</span>

Please opine on whether the Abu Ghraib details should be included, and if so, in what form.

==== Summary of dispute by GorillaWarfare ====
<div style="font-size:smaller">Please keep it brief - less than 2000 characters if possible, it helps us help you quicker.</div>
Platner's service in Iraq is already described in his biographical article; EasternShah has been pushing to include Platner's presence at the [[Abu Ghraib prison]] specifically. EasternShah's [https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Talk:Graham_Platner&diff=prev&oldid=1344038713 first stated reason] to include it was that {{tq|Abu Ghraib was quite a significant location in the Iraq War}}. I [https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Talk%3AGraham_Platner&diff=1344039899&oldid=1344038713 pointed out] that {{tq|"Abu Ghraib was quite a significant location in the Iraq War" ''because'' of the human rights abuses. If Platner was uninvolved in them, why is his presence there noteworthy?}} They then [https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Talk:Graham_Platner&diff=prev&oldid=1344041317 argued] it should be included because:
{{tqb|I think it should be included because Abu Ghraib was a place were horrible atrocities took place, and many people do bad things because of peer pressure. Many bad incidents have happened because of peer pressure, especially in the context of the American invasion of Iraq, such as the Mahmudiyah rape and killings. However, Platner was responsible enough in that moment, surrounded by such grave ills, not to take part in any of those things. What an upstanding citizen, and someone perfect to be senator! That's why I think it should be included.}}
This is a poor argument for inclusion and smacks of POV-pushing.

In my view, Platner's presence at the prison is not widely described in RS and seems to have been a fairly minor feature in his military career. In order to mention it in the article, explain to readers why the Abu Ghraib prison is noteworthy, and then explain that Platner was not involved in the human rights abuses for which it's known, I think we'd end up giving a lot of weight to a fairly insignificant detail. My feeling is it's not worth including unless reliable sources begin covering it in greater depth. [[User:GorillaWarfare|GorillaWarfare]]&nbsp;(she/her&nbsp;•&nbsp;[[User talk:GorillaWarfare|talk]]) 22:52, 18 March 2026 (UTC)

==== Summary of dispute by Generalrelative ====
<div style="font-size:smaller">Please keep it brief - less than 2000 characters if possible, it helps us help you quicker.</div>
I'm not sure I have much to add to what GorillaWarfare has stated above, other than to concur, and to state that EasternShah's statement below is misleading on a couple of points. 

1) {{tq|Originally...}} Before this revert, GW and I had already made it clear on the talk page that ''if'' this material is to be included it needs to be rephrased to clearly indicate that Platner had nothing to do with the human rights abuses at Abu Ghraib ''and'' a minimal argument for relevance / due weight needs to be made. Despite numerous requests, ES has been unable to provide such an argument. While this conversation was ongoing, ES proceeded to [https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Graham_Platner&diff=1344034836&oldid=1344028972 edit war a long string of provocative comments back into the BLP lead], including the Abu Ghraib reference. It was only then that I reverted the entirety of the additions with the edit summary {{tq|Rolling back contested material. Please refer to WP:BLPRESTORE.}} 

2) The argument that {{tq|Platner has not received that much publicity}} is demonstrably and wildly false. GW has [https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Talk%3AGraham_Platner&diff=1344039774&oldid=1344038713 already pointed ES to the article's <u>78</u> sources.] The fact remains that very few of these sources even mention that Platner was once present at Abu Ghraib, so it seems undue for us to do so.

[[User:Generalrelative|Generalrelative]] ([[User talk:Generalrelative|talk]]) 05:47, 19 March 2026 (UTC)

====Additional comments by EasternShah====
Originally, Generalrelative [https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Graham_Platner&diff=prev&oldid=1344035284 removed] the content citing [[WP:BLPRESTORE]], which states {{tq|When material about living persons has been deleted on good-faith BLP objections, any editor wishing to add, restore, or undelete it must ensure it complies with Wikipedia's content policies.}} The Abu Ghraib been covered in a reliable source, it doesn't damage the neutrality of the article, and there aren't other reasons like article size to exclude the fact from the article. The [[WP:UNDUE]] claims are very minor in my view. Platner has not received that much publicity, as he hasn't even been elected to senate yet. The second argument that was quoted above was to demonstrate that a reader could take a favorable or negative view of content, which doesn't automatically make it negative.
'''[[User:EasternShah|<span style="color:#4a5d23;">Sahi</span><span style="color:#fcd116;">b</span>-<span style="color:#4a5d23;">''e''</span>-<span style="color:#fcd116;">Q</span><span style="color:#4a5d23;">iran</span>]]''', EasternShah 00:42, 19 March 2026 (UTC)

=== Graham Platner discussion ===
<div style="font-size:smaller">Please keep discussion to a minimum before being opened by a volunteer. Continue on article talk page if necessary.</div>