Editing Talk:Milton Keynes (section)

== Economy, finances and business ==

The [[Centre for Cities]] have redesigned their web page so that the raw economic data is less accessible. Fortunately, Archive.org has captured earlier versions so I will be working on this section over the next few days to put some dates on the statements and broaden the perspective.  Advice here will be welcome. --[[User:John Maynard Friedman|John Maynard Friedman]] ([[User talk:John Maynard Friedman|talk]]) 12:11, 8 February 2022 (UTC)
:By the way, those who questioned the statements in the article citing [[wp:NPOV]] and [[WP:OR]] should read those policy articles again. The only challenge that looks to me as having any basis is [[wp:SYNTH]]. But as a local editor, I suppose [[Wikipedia:Mandy Rice-Davies applies]] so I won't pursue it. --[[User:John Maynard Friedman|John Maynard Friedman]] ([[User talk:John Maynard Friedman|talk]]) 17:33, 8 February 2022 (UTC)

Meanwhile, these are the historic data
* [https://web.archive.org/web/20160126075844/http://www.centreforcities.org/city/milton-keynes/  2014 data, archived 14/11/15]: 
** GVA per Worker (£) 2014 = 63,650.87 (4/62)
** Patents granted (per 100,000 of population) 2014 = 8.49 (9/63)
** Business Start-ups (per 10,000 population) 2014 = 75.42 (3/63)
** Business Closures (per 10,000 population) 2014 = 46.49 (3/63)
<small>
* [https://web.archive.org/web/20161231113207/http://www.centreforcities.org/city/milton-keynes/ 2014 data, archived 31/12/16]
* [https://web.archive.org/web/20171226170415/http://www.centreforcities.org/city/milton-keynes/ 2014 data, archived 26/12/17]
</small>
* [https://web.archive.org/web/20181109092529/http://www.centreforcities.org/city/milton-keynes/ 2017 data, archived 09/11/18]
** GVA per worker (£) 2017...72,980.72 (3/62)
** Patent Applications (per 100,000 of population) 2017 = 16.2 (20/63)
** Business Start-ups (per 10,000 population) 2017 = 78.69 (5/62)
** Business Closures (per 10,000 population) 2017 = 68.78 (5/62)
<small>
* [https://web.archive.org/web/20191218082120/http://www.centreforcities.org/city/milton-keynes/ 2017 data, archived 18/12/19]
* [https://web.archive.org/web/20201128042906/http://www.centreforcities.org/city/milton-keynes/ 2017 data, archived 28/11/20]
</small>
* [https://www.centreforcities.org/city/milton-keynes/ Live version as of today, 8/2/22] (2020 data)
** GVA per '''hour''' (£) 2020 = 43.9 (7/62) average 35.1
** Patent Applications (per 100,000 of population) 2020 = 27.0 (11/63) average 17.8
** Business Start-ups (per 10,000 population) 2020 = 66.4 (6/62)  average 53.3
** Business Closures (per 10,000 population) 2020 = 74.6 (?/62)  average 47.2

The problem now is how best to summarise this data without being accused of POV and OR? --[[User:John Maynard Friedman|John Maynard Friedman]] ([[User talk:John Maynard Friedman|talk]]) 17:33, 8 February 2022 (UTC) Updated to add 'league table' positions found on spray diagram. --11:10, 9 February 2022 (UTC)
:You seem to have inserted POV inferences from primary sourced material and POV language -- even "productive" is unsourced -- in this article. Perhaps you can propose text with references here and we can all workshop it.[[User:SPECIFICO |<b style="color: #0011FF;"> SPECIFICO</b>]][[User_talk:SPECIFICO | ''talk'']] 18:44, 8 February 2022 (UTC)
::FWIW, the primary source is the ONS. The Centre for Cities is a secondary. And the current version (at least) says {{tq|Productivity: GVA per hour (£)}}. I'm afraid you will have to point out the POV wording, I'm not seeing it. [M R-D again!] --[[User:John Maynard Friedman|John Maynard Friedman]] ([[User talk:John Maynard Friedman|talk]]) 20:50, 8 February 2022 (UTC)
:::"Successful economies" ? Not even sure what that might mean. It doesn't have its own isolated "economy" and economies do not have a purpose that can be graded for success.  Etc. [[User:SPECIFICO |<b style="color: #0011FF;"> SPECIFICO</b>]][[User_talk:SPECIFICO | ''talk'']] 21:51, 8 February 2022 (UTC)
::::Yes, I see the logic in that but struggle to think of a succinct way of saying essentially the same thing. "... performs significantly above national average on a range of economic indicators" is maybe more accurate but talk about deathly prose! Never call a spade a spade when you can call it a bi-pedal regolithic excavation implement. Suggestions, anyone?  
::::Just to complicate things, having found where they've moved the 'league table' positions, I see that the 2020 data is not as 'significantly above average' as were 2014 and 2017. So maybe the lazy solution is to let readers draw their own conclusions but it still needs an intro sentence.
::::(BTW, lest I be accused next of cherry-picking, also on my to-do list is to add something about Skills and Educational Performance from the same C4C report. And public/private jobs ratio.) --[[User:John Maynard Friedman|John Maynard Friedman]] ([[User talk:John Maynard Friedman|talk]]) 11:10, 9 February 2022 (UTC)